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Astrotheme Untrustworthy for Birth Times?

Astrotheme Untrustworthy for Birth Times?One of the challenges with western astrology is that it requires an accurate birth time in order to calculate a complete horoscope or birth chart for a person. Astrologers often like to use the charts of celebrities as examples in order to demonstrate various astrological techniques and concepts, since their lives tend to be so well-documented, and as a result of this celebrity birth times are often highly sought-after by astrologers. While the pros and cons of using celebrity birth charts are sometimes debated by astrologers, the practice is pervasive.

Birth data collection itself becomes almost like a separate skill set that astrologers have to develop in order to obtain birth times. This is because there can be many challenges and complications involved in finding out what time a person was born, especially if you don’t know them personally. Astrologers draw on a wide variety of different sources in order to determine or confirm when a person was born, such as obtaining a copy of their birth certificate, birth announcements, the recollection of parents or other family members, and so on.

In the 20th century entire databases were created in order to collect birth data and provide background information about where it came from and how reliable the source is. Astrodienst’s AstroDatabank is the largest and most well-respected example of this sort of database in the astrological community, and they employ a system for classifying the reliability of birth data called the Rodden Rating system, which has become the industry standard. AstroDatabank is not the only purveyor of birth data though, and another website that frequently shows up in the results when you search for celebrity birth times is Astrotheme.

Astrotheme is a French website founded in 2002, which has pages set up for thousands of celebrities where you can see their birth chart, a biography, and a computerized delineation of some parts of the celebrity’s horoscope. The purpose of these long reports appears to be that they help to draw in traffic and advertise the personalized reports that Astrotheme sells to visitors. Since Astrotheme is one of the few websites which lists celebrity birth times besides AstroDatabank, their pages often rank very high in the search results, and sometimes when AstroDatabank does not list a known birth time for a celebrity you will be able to find it on Astrotheme.

Unfortunately Astrotheme has gained a reputation over the past decade amongst some data collectors I know for not being very reliable when it comes to the birth times that they give for some celebrities. Usually the birth times they list are just taken from AstroDatabank or other birth data collections, and in those cases the data will be more or less reliable. However, in instances where there is no known birth time for the celebrity in any of the databases Astrotheme will sometimes claim to have obtained it from another source.

This first came to my attention maybe 7 or 8 years ago, because I noticed that they often listed exact birth times for a number of celebrities even though the other databases said that those birth times were unknown. At first I thought that this was great, since it gave me another source for birth times when the other databases failed. However, there was one glaring issue at that point, which is that they didn’t seem to regularly list their sources for the birth times on their website, so it wasn’t clear where they had obtained the data from. This is problematic because sometimes in the astrological community if you see a birth time with no source it means that the time was rectified through astrological means. This is problematic since rectifications are not always accurate, and thus they are not usually treated as reliable by birth data collectors. In some instances a poorly done rectification is no better than just a random guess at the correct birth time.

Examples of Unreliable Sources

In 2009 one astrologer I know went so far as to write to Astrotheme in order to request that they start listing the sources for their birth times, because they commonly didn’t at that point. Here is the email:

Hello Astrotheme,

You have a really incredible service going. Absolutely incredible. This could be a really wonderful tool of research, but I have one suggestion. The site would be just that much more incredible if you gave the sources for all the birthdata. Sometimes when I’m searching for a birth time, you will be the only site on the internet that gives a birth time for someone, but I can’t really trust it because you give no source. I don’t know if someone just rectified it or if you actually have a credible source for the birth information. Will we ever see this on Astrotheme?

Their response was a bit disappointing, basically saying that it would take too much time to list their sources for all of the biographies, and instead saying that astrologers should just email them if they want to find out the source for the birth time they list for a specific person:

We do better: we answer for any question about a celebrity. We have around 100 and more sources. It is a lot of time, and we propose the best source, because we compare all. If you have any question about one person, ask and we will give you the source and comments. It will take about 6 months to finish all the biographies, and to enter sources would be too much time, but we can find it if you ask. We answer everyday for that.

My friend then asked a followup question about a specific birth time that they listed on their website for the actress Jennifer Love Hewitt:

Ah that’s great. I didn’t know you could do that. Could you please look up the source for Jennifer Love Hewitt’s birthtime?

They responded:

Sure, For her, for example:

But it is not a “very good” source, unfortunately.

The link takes you to some random commercial astrology website that sells computerized reports, which lists the same exact birth time for Hewitt that Astrotheme gives, also with no source. They do have a notice on their site though saying that the primary astrology website that they use for finding celebrity birth times is, surprisingly, Astrotheme. In other words, the source that Astrotheme cited for this piece of birth data claims that Astrotheme itself is their primary source.

What this demonstrates is that back somewhere around 2009 Astrotheme had a general policy of not listing their sources for every entry, and while you could email them to request the source of the birth time, in some instances the source would either not be very reliable, or would lead back to Astrotheme itself.

Another inquiry in 2009 about the exact birth time listed for the actress Kate Winslet produced an even more dismaying response from Astrotheme:

7:15 is found on many sites, we have taken the same birth time, but it seems that this is not sure.

For example: or or

Everybody says “We don’t know Kate‘s birth time for sure but the Internet widely reports 5th October 1975, 07:15am BST, Reading, UK. “.

So, basically in some instances, like with Kate Winslet, they just list whatever speculative birth time seems to be floating around the internet. In other instances, like with Jennifer Love Hewitt, there becomes this circular loop where they cite other websites for the data, and those same websites cite Astrotheme as their primary source, which implies that at some stage in this process someone fabricated the birth time and put it on their website as legitimate. The question is who?

A Fabricated Birth Time?

I’m not sure if Astrotheme’s policy on citing sources for birth times has changed since 2009, but I get the impression that it may have, because I’ve come across a few instances where they cite old entertainment magazines as the source for their birth times recently. For example, even though neither AstroDatabank nor any of the the biographical works I’ve found give a birth time, Astrotheme lists an exact time of 11:04 AM for the rapper Eminem, citing the November 2000 issue of a German teen magazine called Bravo. Here is a screenshot. Based on this I thought that perhaps Astrotheme was starting to get better about both listing their sources and doing the necessary research in order to obtain accurate birth times. But unfortunately the situation may have have actually gotten worse rather than better.

I was recently trying to find the birth time of rapper Kanye West by doing searches for it on Google. AstroDatabank has no entry for Kanye West, but Astrotheme does, so they come up as the first result when you search for the phrase “Kanye West birth time.” I was both surprised and happy to see that they listed not only an exact birth time for him of 8:45 AM, but they also gave a source for the birth time, which they claimed was from an article in the October 2007 issue of Blender Magazine. Here is a screenshot.

Blender Magazine, October 2007So, that seemed pretty good, but I wanted to verify the source for myself just to be sure, so I did a search on Amazon and ordered a copy of that old issue of Blender Magazine from 2007. It just showed up in the mail today, and I was shocked after I read through it and found that not only does the article not mention Kanye’s birth time, but it doesn’t even list his birth date. There is just one brief biographical reference to the fact that he was born in 1977, and that’s it. No birth time, even though Astrotheme cites this exact issue as the source for the birth time they list on their website.

So, we have a bit of a problem here. While it is nice in theory that Astrotheme seems to be making more of an effort to cite their sources for birth times now, in this instance even though they cited a specific source for the exact birth time they gave, the source does not support the time they claimed. So, this makes it look like someone concocted a false birth time and then provided a fake citation in order to give it an air of legitimacy, for some unknown reason. This is arguably even worse than listing no source for the time at all, because astrologers generally know that they shouldn’t trust unsourced birth times, whereas the citation of a legitimate publication in this instance might otherwise lead people to take this time more seriously than they otherwise should. In point of fact, at least one astrologer has written an article about Kanye West in just the past few months using the 8:45 AM time from Astrotheme, so there are astrologers out there who have been misled by the faulty time listed on their website.

The more troubling question here is whether this was just a fluke, or whether it is a more common practice. Unfortunately I don’t know the answer to this question, although I find it troubling that other data collectors on AstroDatabank who have checked the sources for birth times that Astrotheme cites for the rapper Jay-Z, the actress Jennifer Lawrence, and the actor Hugh Jackman report they do not in fact mention those times at all. So, I would encourage more people to research this issue in order to find out just how extensive it is.

In the meantime, the main point that I want to convey with this article is simply that I do not personally believe that Astrotheme is a reliable source for birth data because of issues like the ones I’ve cited above, and in light of that I would recommend that astrologers avoid using them as a source for unverified birth data, at least unless or until they take steps to implement some better practices.

At this point in history it is important for astrologers to to start taking birth data collection more seriously. One way that we can do this is by implementing systems like the Rodden Rating system which allow for a greater degree of sophistication in describing the sources of the data that we use. It is not enough to just list a birth time that you got from some random website anymore, but it is important to also know where that time came from, how reliable it is, and whether there is any conflicting information that should be taken into account. By taking just a few simple steps like this we will create a much better environment for conducting proper research in the field of astrology.

24 replies on “Astrotheme Untrustworthy for Birth Times?”

Thanks for this, Chris. You’re doing a far better service for the astrological community than anyone posting inaccurate birthtimes and claiming unreliable sources for their data. Why is it so difficult to accept that, as astrologers, we sometimes have to work with untimed birthcharts? Though some details of a chart will obviously be unavailable to us, there’s still plenty of insight to be reaped from simply looking at major aspects between planets. I’d rather be forthright about the limitations in certain birth data and work with what I’ve got.

I’ve always seen Astrotheme as unreliable as far as accurate, documented birth times go. Even Astrodatabank has/had its issues with people reporting bad birth times. But at least they mostly noted it those as DD – Dirty Data.

Yes, I have absolutely run into this problem! Thank you for bringing it up. And while I appreciate the Rodden system of birth chart ratings/sources, I noticed mistakes on birth dates on their software as well. This is one of the great challenges of being part of a field in which most research relies on one or two people’s passion/curiosity and lacks the funding that researchers in other fields have to double and triple check everything, and we need to become more aware of it, especially if using celebrity birth charts to back up theories or assertions. One example: if you’re using the Astrotheme birth time for Layne Staley’s chart, it’s wrong. I know from a family member that he was born at night, not in the morning. When I see the 7am birth time, I can’t help wondering of some astrologer decided he must have a Pisces Moon and ‘rectified it’ accordingly

An example of inaccuracy is the chart of Eric Harris, one of the Columbine shooters. Astrotheme states in his profile that he was born in Plattsburgh, NY, when he was born in Wichita, KS. Even in their profile of his co-shooter, Dylan Klebold, Astrotheme states that Harris was born in Wichita.

Agreed. I also agree with astrobarry. The 6 am Solar chart can tell a lot psychologically and otherwise! Better than having incorrect charts made public. I hate the fact that so much of Astrology out there on the web is incorrect and new people to the field are learning it and doing it all wrong and to have a professional website have inaccurate charts is just not right. I have been thinking this for years. Plus, with Facebook, anyone can say anything Astrologically and it is set in stone and written word! So upsetting and so sad.

For the longest time they had Theresa Caputo the Long Island Medium lady as a Cancerian. The woman herself has said publicly in person, on TV, her own show and in her book that her birthday is June 10th, making her a Gemini. I wrote to tell them that it was an error and she was Gemini and they replied saying I need to show them facts before they would change it. I stated that her own bio written by herself should be all they need? I see they recently changed it. I’m glad! Thanks for writing the article. I hope they change the way they do things at Astrotheme.

Great article and I really like Barry’s comments. Yes there are limitations and yes we can proceed with adjustments. xo

Excellent article. Unfortunately I too regard Astrotheme’s timed charts as extremely dubious and unreliable. I guess if it seems too good to be true, it probably is. They won’t cite their sources unless you ask, and then it seems as if they are made up out of thin air or possibly rectified. Who knows? It’s very disappointing.

Just to restate what I said elsewhere, I had sent Astrotheme a couple of birth times for two rockstars. I specified exactly where the data was from – one was from a fan magazine, and the other was simply word of mouth from a fan on a forum. To my amazement, none of that was listed with the chart data. This was very different from Astrodatabank, which uses the Rodden rating. There are surely mistakes, but at least they are making an effort to be accurate and transparent.

Another example:

Astrotheme has a page for the actor Joaquin Phoenix. They list a birth time for him of 2:55 AM. In the source notes they say that the birth time comes from the following YouTube video which they link to:

Right at the beginning of the video the astrologer who narrates it says:

“…we don’t have a birth time on him… so let’s look and let me tell you why I rectified his chart to 2:55 AM.”

She then proceeds to explain how she came up with that time according to some of the techniques she uses in Indian astrology.

So, in this instance Astrotheme is just listing a rectified birth time that they found from some random astrologer on YouTube.

We do our best since 2002. All the times of birth have a source, and a lot of them are the birth certificates with the number, some other are less reliable : it is written in the biography chapter.

It’s an endless work, we spend a lot of time every day. We display progressively the sources of the birth times since 2008.

When the source is not displayed in the biography, unfortunately still for a lot of them, we answer as fast as we can by email to give our source. So anybody can know if the source is reliable (birth certificate), or not.

We do not claim anything, as it is written in our disclaimer comment, at each page : some times of birth are not reliable, we know it, and say it, as you confirm it.

We just try to bring these informations, and the purpose is this one : regarding the sources of the birth data in our possession, kindly note that the pages we publish constitute a starting point for more detailed research, even though they seem useful to us. When the sources are contradictory, which occurs rarely, after having analysed them, we choose the most reliable one. Sometimes, we publish a birth date just because it is made available, but we do not claim that is it the best one, by no means.

I subscribed to Astrotheme a few years back so this might be out of date but I started receiving tons of junk emails tout en français

Mister Goulding, we are sorry, but fortunately, no junk emails are sent, never, from our website, since 2002. There is only one newsletter, weekly, and you can be removed immediately in one click, at the bottom of the newsletter, as usually. We never send any email to any third part. You can check our page about your privacy and our confidential policy. If you have received the newsletter in French, we are sorry, this is probably because you have created an account on the French site: just email us please, and it will be fixed immediately.

@Astrotheme – I don’t feel like you responded adequately to the original point of the article. Why are there so many entries on your website where you claim to have found the birth time from a book or a magazine, but when people have looked in those sources no birth time is mentioned? In the article above I was able to cite at least 4 examples of different celebrities on your website where this has occurred. This makes it look like a pattern, as if you are doing it deliberately. Is this deliberate? If not, will you be taking any steps to fix the issue on your website, and implement better practices so that it does not happen again? So far it does not look like you have fixed any of the entries that were mentioned in this article, even though they have clearly been shown to be fabricated times.

Here are two more fabricated sources given in Astrotheme:
1. Hugh Jackman: Lepoivre claims that the birth time of 1 pm is found in the biography by Anthony Bunko, but this claim can not be verifed. The birth time is not given in that book.
2. Clive James: Lepoivre claims that the birth time of 9 pm is found in Frank Clifford’s book British Entertainers, but there is no entry on Clive in this book

@Brennan and @Starkman Hi, never, a time of birth has been fabricated, how could it be, since thousands of data come from the celebrities themselves, for our contributors with birth certificates since 2002 etc. it would be suicidal for us to make dirty our database. We are going to answer you for all the cases mentionned in your blog today, one moment please, we do this work today, we do our best to answer you soon.

We understand your comments, thank you very much. We try to improve the database, and we receive every day a lot of times of birth by the celebrities themselves, by our contributors, and we quote all the data we add when it is a website. We do not claim our database is perfect, we we try to do our best, and we hope it is useful for everybody.

If anybody has a question about a source, please write us at we will answer you as fast as possible.

You will find our detailed anwer below.

– For Jennifer Love Hewitt, the source is Imdb :
When her time of birth had been found, probably several years ago, when we did not put the source on the pages, the source was probably another site, and we had not kept this source. So when it has been asked, we have searched on Google, this is the reason for After that, we have found a new source, more reliable, Imdb.
– Same for Winslet, the source is Imdb :
– For Eminem, the source was an email. As we have not the possibility to buy and read this magazine, we have put the source sent to us. If it happens that it is a wrong information, we will removed it immediately. But we have no reason no to keep it until this.
– For Kanye West, Blender Magazine, October 2007 had been sent to us by email. This is the same case. We cannot read this magazine, so we have put this source. We just read your comment, and have taken off his time of birth. We will search in our archive the email which has sent us these data, and will publish it, if we find it. From memory, it was the same email that had given us several times of birth, with some magazines as sources.
Concerning the article about West, it is from one of our authors, in our team. We will add to morrow a comment to point out that his time of birth is unknown and to consider this before reading it, and not to take into account the astrological houses of West.

As we said, the sources have been written since about 2008, only for the new data, and progressively for the old ones. And for this case, we ask now a copy od the document.
For example, this morning, May 4, 2015, times we have received an email which says: “Time of birth of Bethany Hamilton is 2:10 A.M. Book: Raising a Soul Surfer by Cheri Hamilton”. In the past, we put this data in our pages immediately with the source. Now, we prefer not to do this, and we have asked the copy of the document, before we publish it: we improve our procedures to take into account your comments.

– For Jay-Z, we have received an email with 12:30 AM, “from The Black Album booklet”. For Jennifer Lawrence, an email gives “Gateway Biography”. We had no reason in the past no to trust the people who send this kind of informations. We read that it has been checked that the times of birth was not inside these documents. This encourages us to ask the copy of the document in the future, and not to publish a time of birth without this copy. For Hugh Jackman, “Hugh Jackman: The Biography by Anthony Bunko” has been sent to us. You say it has been checked that the time of birth is not inside. We have updated the charts of Jay-Z, Lawrence, and Jackman, with unknown time of birth. We would like to say, once more, that never, these times of birth have been fabricated. But you are right that our procedures must be improved, by asking the documents for each time of birth, this will be the case now, systematically.

– For Staley, it was an email before 2008 (probably Staley himself, a friend, or a member of his family). We will search in our archives this email, and if we find it, we will ask the person to confirm this time of birth. In the meantime, we have deleted his time of birth, it is done.
– For Eric Harris, we don’t see a problem, the source is Astrodatabank, and the city of birth is Plattsburgh, New York. If there is an error on Astrodatabank, maybe Frank Piechoski could write them? We do not claim anything, since we cite the source. And for the biography of Dylan Klebold, it comes from Wikipedia, it is not a problem of us. But as you point out this fact that in the biography of Wikipedia it is not the same city of birth as on Astrodatabank, we have just updated his page. It is done.

– For Joaquin Phoenix, the source was given, so anyone could see that is was a rectified time, but you are right, it was not written in our page: it is done, we have added this information, thank you very much.

– Hugh Jackman : we note that you have checked that his time of birth was not in this biography of Anthony Bunko. Thank you Isaac Starkman. We have updated his chart. The important point now, is that we understand that a document is needed to publish a time of birth, and we ask it now. Our procedures have changed and it will be the case now, for all the future data.
– Clive James: we are sorry Isaac Starkman, we have the book in our hands: page 313, Clive James, born 7 October 1939, 21.00 AEST (-10), Sydney Australia. Our source is exact. Our edition is the third edition, fully revised and expanded, maybe you have not the same edition.

My apology for Clive James: his data is indeed in Clifford’s book, I didn’t check the Australian Data Section.
I’m very glad that you have decided to change the procedure and to check the original source for each birth time.

Astrotheme celebrities charts can be fun, but we ought to consider the birth dates as unreliable. For an extreme example, go to and request the chart for “Muhammad”, spelled just that way. Astrotheme gives a chart for April 22, 571 (Julian) with Sun in Taurus, Moon in Virgo and Aquarius rising.

Then request “Mohammed birth date” from the Internet.
Here’s one result:
“Sunni Muslims observe the Prophet Muhammed’s (also known as Mohammed or Muhammad) birthday on the 12th day of the Islamic month of Rabi’ al-awwal, while Shi’a Muslims mark it on the 17th of this month.”
Five days difference observed by two factions of Muslims themselves!

If you keep looking at sites, you’ll see other calendar translations to June 8 570 and April 20 571. Notice that people can’t even agree whether he was born in 570 or 571. Thus available records can only claim to give data within about a year, so how could anyone calculate an accurate chart? Cited sources would be nice! If chart rectification was involved, please do cite the author.

@MB Thank you very much for your comment. If you read carefully all our former answers, you will see that progressively, we add the source in all the pages with a time of birth. It is done progressively since 2009 for the old data, and it is done in 100% of cases since this date for the new data. We do our best to go fast and finish to add all the sources, but anyone can write us and ask the source when it is not written on the biography chapter.

For Muhammad (the source of the name is Wikipedia the time was a rectified date and time, and we agree that for this case, it does not make much sense to keep this chart. It has been deleted.

Hi Chris,

nice to meet you and thanks for bringing up this interesting topic. I’d like to add my ideas and experiences here.

I agree with you on these points:

1. Of course, Astrodienst is providing a lot of relevant data and their concept of RR is amazing.
2. Some birth times on Astrotheme appear to be experimental.

My own experience is, that there can be different reasons for birthtimes to be inaccurate, especially when it comes to celebrities. E.g. I had found the birth time of German New Age author Bärbel Mohr. It had been published by herself, knowing her own birth certificate. Later she died and her husband didn’t like my interpretation of her horoscope. So he removed the time from their website. Then Astrodienst had asked me, where I got the birth time from. I told them. Exactly what I wrote here. They then asked her husband and he wouldn’t give them any information. So they arbitrarily changed the birth time in their data base. It’s now in there but 30 minutes false. I don’t know, how they deal with other birth times, but this is an example I can confirm, where the given birth time on Astrodienst is not correct.,_B%C3%A4rbel

Then there are political reasons for fake birth times and even places. Hillary Clinton is one example. She seems to basically lie about anything but on Astrodienst gets two charts that from her bio both don’t make sense, while two very interesting hints on her most probable time of birth are hidden far below in the article.,_Hillary

Don’t get me wrong: I love Astrodienst and even use my account there to create the basic horoscopes I then need to put into a design software to add all the extra points I use in my astrological work. Their ephemerides are awesomely accurate which doesn’t seem to be the case for all astrological software on the market.

I think, a professional astrologer should always check given birt times to see if they make sense or not, whether they’re coming from Astrodienst, Astrotheme or any other source.

Thanks for your attention and

Saludos de los Andes,

Alexander 🙂

You are very generous in your “incredibility” assessment of Astrotheme. They are not only unreliable with birth times but, also, with online charts (had to cancel an SR trip, as a result. When I brought this to their attention was told my Email address had been blocked from their server..

In addition it is beyond-noticeable that they are almost always listed first on the internet list of astrology sites. — Any idea how much tis costs them !

Would not refer them to anyone ! (Eve Hillary Clinton’s chart is wrong ! (Imagine !) Her ascendant is not the Leo they’ve come up with but Scorpio. Any decent astrologer knows that she is a double Scorpio. Seems like their own chart must be a double (at least !) Leo.

Dear Lynne Murguia,

1. Concerning your first point, the published times of birth are reliable only when the birth certificates exist. For the other cases, as for Clinton, when there are several conflicting sources, the sources are not reliable.

For this case, we publish the data of Imdb and the source, and we do not claim at all that this source is reliable. We do write our source, and also our disclaimer in the Clinton’s page:

a. Our source: “birth time source: gives “at the stroke of midnight (12 AM CST).”

b. Our disclaimer: Regarding the sources of the birth data in our possession, kindly note that the pages we publish constitute a starting point for more detailed research, even though they seem useful to us. When the sources are contradictory, which occurs rarely, after having analysed them, we choose the most reliable one. Sometimes, we publish a birth date just because it is made available, but we do not claim that is it the best one, by no means.

This is clear. If one day, more serious informations are available for Clinton, we will update her page. We have also a project, to publish different times of birth on the same page, when there are different sources (as for Clinton). So it will be a bonus, even more interesting than now.

2. Concerning your email, no email has never been blocked. Our contact page is at the bottom of all the pages of the website. We always answer.

3. Concerning the charts, if you find one day an error, which is aways possible as on any website, it could be the atlas for a particular case, or an error from you when you enter your data etc., we would answer you immediately.

4. For your last idea, we have never spent one cent to be listed anywhere.

We invite you to write us and to use our contact page if you have some questions, we will answer you with pleasure and in details.

Kind regards,

Astrotheme Team